Tionesta NA

Tionesta NA, West Fork Foray

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TOPIC: W Fork Foray, Tionesta N.A.
http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees/browse_thread/thread/322b461485ed19f7?hl=en
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== 1 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 5 2008 5:02 pm
From: "Dale Luthringer"

ENTS,

On 11/13/07, Anthony Kelly, Carl Harting, and I met on the Brookston
side of the Tionesta Scenic & Natural Area to explore new potential old
growth forest on West Fork Run. We headed north from a logging road
crossroads along a gas well access road on the hilltop. We soon dipped
down over the hill following a contour that would eventually take us to
West Fork Run. After about a half mile from our vehicle we started to
get into a very nice old growth hemlock stand. The farther we continued
along our easterly route and map contour, the better it got. Ancient
hemlocks were everywhere. The sad thing, was that beech bark disease
had taken out virtually all the ancient beech. Many of the old trunks
were down with just a few still standing. The beech sapling undergrowth
was absolutely awful to walk through. I'm thinking maybe a hockey mask
would be a nice addition to all our other Ents gadgets...

Hemlocks were in the upper 110ft class near the top of the hill, but we
were soon into the mid 120's as we progressed further into the valley.
One tree almost got into the 130ft class. Anthony had been in this area
before on a previous trip, but he ended up reaching the run a good bit
further downstream than when we came across it that day. West Fork Run
was a beautiful cool mountain stream surrounding by ancient hemlocks on
both sides.

We explored a little south of the stream, but soon resumed our more
easterly course upstream heading to the N/S right-of-way (ROW). It was
here that we split up. Anthony & Carl stayed on the south side of the
run, and I continued on the north side, both groups working their way to
the ROW. Carl & Anthony noted old growth further south, but it appeared
the tree dimensions petered off, so they continued their easterly route.
I was in old growth the entire time as I worked east on the north side
of the run towards the ROW. I had been in this area about 3 years ago,
but was much higher on the hill.

All I can say, is that the West Fork is absolutely the best section of
old growth remaining in the Tionesta Scenic Area. Ancient hemlocks
abound. They do not surpass the concentration and size of Cook Forest,
but it is an exceptional old growth wilderness experience. It was a
pleasure to not be experiencing this site alone for once. Carl &
Anthony were excellent companions. These guys have really turned out to
be a super research team to work with. Will, all you have to do is
point them in the right direction and let them go. You won't be
disappointed.

Anyway, once I reached the ROW, I met back up with Carl & Anthony and
exchanged notes. We then headed south on the ROW to take a brief look
at East Fork Run. It was definitely old growth all the way, mostly on
both sides of the ROW, but it was of much better quality on the west
side. Once we hit the downhill turn to East Fork, it wasn't long until
we ran out of old growth. The old growth line pretty much ran out when
the hill got the steepest just before you would have to seriously commit
going down the hill to East Fork. We did a quick visual survey for old
growth crown architecture along East Fork, and determined it wasn't
worth the effort on this hike to journey further into the next drainage
south, Crane Run. So, we stopped just short of East Fork, did an about
face, headed back to West Fork and explored a good portion of the upper
reaches of the run on the east side of the ROW.

Old growth hemlock continued from the ROW up West Fork for a good 1/2 of
mile, before the beech brush started to take its toll. We surveyed both
forks of the upper West Fork Run about 1/2 mile up each stream from the
junction point. It was at roughly these distances that the ancient
hemlock became more spread out, and the beech brush more dense. Before
the onslaught of the beech bark disease, this site would've been an
incredible area. I would still call it old growth, its just that the
forest is now busy bringing in the next age class under the ancients.

We then worked back downstream and headed north along the ROW. Beech
brush was very thick on both sides so we didn't venture too far off the
road. One ancient hemlock on the western side Anthony measured to
12.8ft CBH x 123.6ft high. I decided to bushwhack to another dandy on
the east side to give Carl a pole measurement. From down in the beech
brush about 100 yards out, they certainly couldn't see me, and could
only barely see the stick I was waiving. After a few calls from them to
wiggle some of the saplings I was at so they could find me, it brought
back flashbacks from the movie 'Cool Hand Luke', and I started yelling,
"I'm shakin' it, boss! I'm shakin' it!" Carl scoped it out at 11.3ft
CBH x 123.6ft high.

Along the ROW we counted a few rings on hemlocks that had been cut off
the road:

~252 rings at 7.1ft circ ~30ft up from base
~251 rings at 9.1ft circ ~35ft up from base

On my trip to the area on 12/17/02, I counted rings on a hemlock that
was cut off a gas line to ~420 rings at 6.3ft circ ~15ft up from base.
There are certainly many ancient hemlock dead and still standing here.
It is not a walk I'd suggest for those just looking for a leisurely easy
walk into old growth. To find the good stuff here, you have to be ready
for a day hike, and know how to read a map & compass. Let's just say,
it wouldn't be long for a "mutiny" to arise if family members thought it
was going to be a cake walk. But, Anthony & Carl are real diehards.
They could've actually done quite a bit more that day, but my twisted
ankle, that I failed to mention from early on in my hike, was now
starting to give me problems (the adrenaline rush was wearing off from
when we first hit the good stuff about 3 miles back.

We then continued north on the ROW to a well traveled E/W running forest
service access road (gated on both ends). We headed west, and worked
our way back to our vehilcles. Along the way, I showed Anthony & Carl
the nice rock outcrop about 1/2 mile from the gate on the Brookston side,
north side of the forest service road. Went through a couple of nice
crevices, and explored some decent overhangs. A number of these
would've made excellent Indian shelters. Most boulders, some to small
house size, were sandstone intermixed with conglomerate. Another
gorgeous area.

After exploring the outcrop, Carl & Anthony headed to the gate after I
led a wild goose chase trying to find a large 3x black cherry on the
south side of the road. They headed on, but I finally found it just
before dusk. The last time I measured it was almost exactly 6 years
ago. On 11/28/01 I put it at 16.1ft CBH x 121.5ft high. Today, I put
it at 16.6ft CBH x 123.1+ft high. Couldn't get a good shot to base
through the beech brush. My best shot was from directly underneath.
This last tree measure of the day, brought Tionesta's RI up just enough
to now tie the RI for Scott Community Park at 109.56:

Species CBH Height Comments

E. hemlock 11.8 135
Black cherry 16.6(3x) 123.1+
Tuliptree 7.6 119+
Red maple 8.6 113.9
Am. Beech 6.9 108.9
White ash 9 107.2
Sugar maple 6 106.5
Yellow birch 9 99.1+
Black birch 5.3 92.9
Cucumbertree 4.5 90+

Our stats for the day follows:

Species CBH Height Comments

Black cherry 10.9 109+
Black cherry 16.6(3x) 123.1+

E. hemlock 7.7 N/A
E. hemlock 8.4 N/A
E. hemlock 9.7 N/A
E. hemlock N/A N/A ~252 rings at 7.1ft circ ~30ft fm
base
E. hemlock N/A N/A ~251 rings at 9.1ft circ ~35ft fm
bas
E. hemlock 9.8 108.1
E. hemlock 10.6 108.8
E. hemlock 9.2 109.4
E. hemlock 12.8 111.5
E. hemlock N/A 114.6
E. hemlock 8.9 116.6
E. hemlock 10 117.5
E. hemlock 10.7 119.5
E. hemlock 10.7 121.5
E. hemlock 8.9 122.1
E. hemlock 11.3 123.6
E. hemlock 8.4 125.1
E. hemlock 9.3 125.3
E. hemlock 9.8 129.6

Yellow birch 6.5 87.1+

We should be able to find a cuke' in there somewhere to over 100ft, and
eventually bump out the birches with other species so that all trees
measured would at least be over 100. If this was the case, we'd
eventually be looking at an RI for Tionesta N.A. at 111.36. It's
possible, but we're certainly not there yet.

All in all it was a great day. Got to explore some previously non-ENTS
documented old growth, as well as spend time with good friends. Another
great day to be in the woods.

Dale

== 2 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 5 2008 5:07 pm
From: "Edward Frank"

Dale,

Great trip report. I am sorry I could not make it that day.

Ed
----- Original Message -----
F

== 3 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 5 2008 5:51 pm
From: "Dale Luthringer"

Well, Ed,

I almost didn't make it that day either. The fuel pump on my personal
car decided to go out on Slocum Curve before I got to work. Carl
actually had to help pull road guard duty before the tow truck got
there. We were almost 1.5hrs late to reach Anthony in Brookston, hence,
one of the main reasons why we couldn't cover more ground.

Dale

== 4 of 4 ==
Date: Wed, Mar 5 2008 8:53 pm
From: James Parton

Dale,

I would have loved to have been there with you guys. I have never seen
a Black Cherry so big. I never knew they got that big.

Great report.

James P.

== 2 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 5:49 am
From: Beth Koebel

Dale,

I see. I was wondering what the "x3" was about and
now I know.

Beth

== 3 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 6:41 am
From: "Will Blozan"

Beth,

There are multiple specimens in the southern Appalachians that would
outpoint the IL tree. This one is 14'7" X 140.7' tall.

http://www.nativetreesociety.org/fieldtrips/gsmnp/ramsey/ramsey_prong.htm

Will

== 4 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 7:22 am
From: Beth Koebel

Will and others,

Please submit them to the National list. I hate for
Illinois to lose a champ but I want the lists to up to
date and as accurate as possible.

Beth

== 5 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 7:42 am
From: "Will Blozan"

I have a National co-champion currently on the list, but know of slightly
bigger trees.

== 6 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 10:23 am
From: Anthony Kelly

Dale and ents,

A great day in the woods it was. It's always a good day when out with other ents. It was my 6th trip into The Tionesta Scenic and Natural Area. Each time I try to explore a different section. The Tionesta Scenic and Natural Area, for those who don't know, is a part of the 513,000-acre Allegheny National Forest located in Northwestern Pennsylvania. It covers about 4000 acres, almost all of which is old-growth. About 1000 acres were blown down by tornados in 1985. It is technically divided into the Tionesta Scenic Area (about 2000 acres) and the Tionesta Research Natural Area (2113 arcres). Incidently, it is several miles away from the Allegheny River town of Tionesta, PA. Here are some websites about the site: http://www.fs.fed.us/r9/forests/allegheny/recreation/hiking/tionesta/ http://www.nrs.fs.fed.us/rna/pa/allegheny/tionesta/ http://www.dcnr.state.pa.us/FORESTRY/oldgrowth/tionesta.aspx I absolutely love this place! Though the individual trees aren't as big as the ones in Cook Forest and beech bark disease has taken a huge toll, the area really gives you a sense of isolation. To both north and south there are miles of Forest. To get to it from the west, there is about a three or four-mile drive along forest service roads. To get to it from the East there is confusing 6 or 7-mile drive through a maze of forest service roads. (The first time I went there, it took most of the day just to find it.) But, once you are there, you can usually sit quietly among the ancient trees and not hear a single human-generated noise -- something that's you don't often get in most parts of the Northeast these days. Sadly, though the area has never been logged, large parts of it are dotted with old wells, many of which area still pumping. These wells and their pipeline right of ways are the only things that spoil what would other wise be a pristine area. There are still good bits of the old growth to be explored there, though it looks like we've hit the areas that are most promising as far as tree size goes. I hope to make it back there again this spring sometime, if not, then sometime in early summer. I've always wanted to spend a whole week camping out in the surrounding areas of the Allegheny National Forest (where is is permitted), and try to explore the entire 4000 acres. I hope I'll get to do that before the adelgids hit. So far there is no sign of them. Here are some measurements that I've made during my previous visits to the Tionesta areas. Considering the number of times I've been there, these are not a lot tree measurements. Since the area is so big, and there is so much ground to cover, I usually don't stop to measure a tree unless it looks significantly bigger than others I've measured. (Trees whose heights are preceded with a "~" were measured "quick and dirty" shooting straight up with the laser rather than using the more accurate, but time consuming, double sine method.)

11/12/2007
Species CBH Height
E. Hemlock 10.3' 106.0'
E. Hemlock 11.0' 108.7'
E. Hemlock ~110'
E. Hemlock 10.1' 112.8'
E. Hemlock 12.0' 105.7'
E. Hemlock 10.4' 116.3' Red Maple 10.7' ~120'
Red Maple 8.7' ~113'

4/23/2007
Species CBH Height

Black Cherry 9.0' 118.5'
Black Cherry ~129' (This one I should have taken the time to measure properly!)

E. Hemlock 10.6' 121.1'

Red Maple 8.3' ~114'
Red Maple 9.0' ~107'
Red Maple 8.8' ~122' (This one, too.)

7/3/2006Species CBH Height

Black Birch 6.7' ~89'

E. Hemlock 10.5' 113.7'
E. Hemlock 11.6' 128.1'

Red Maple 11.0' 103.7'

I've also counted rings of hemlocks that had fallen across pipeline right of ways and then had sections cut away. The highest count I got was 330 rings from a cutting about 32ft from the base.

Anthony Kelly

== 7 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 10:45 am
From: Josh

Since we're on the subject of big cherries, I posted a photo to the
files folder of a 15+ foot gbh cherry Jess and I found at Big Bald
Branch (Smokies) last summer. There is also a photo of what may be
the world's largest black birch.

Josh

http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees/web/15ftcherry.jpg

== 8 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 11:25 am
From: Kirk Johnson

Anthony,

The silver lining is that the oil, gas, and mineral rights underlying the
Tionesta Research Natural Area were acquired by the Forest Service in 1987.
As part of the agreement that was struck, the existing wells in the area
(approximately 15 of them) were allowed to remain until they stop producing.
As they become played out and unproductive, they will be decommissioned. The
agreement does not allow for redrilling, fracking, or doing anything else to
try to bring production back up. They will probably all be gone within 25
years, if not sooner. No new wells can be drilled elsewhere in the RNA.

However, this does not affect the large pipeline bisecting the Scenic and
Research Natural Areas that leads to the Roystone plant, the wells on Forest
Service land surrounding the old-growth, or the Tionesta Scenic Area where
the oil, gas, and mineral rights are still privately owned.

Kirk Johnson

Sadly, though the area has never been logged, large parts of it are dotted
with old wells, many of which area still pumping. These wells and their
pipeline right of ways are the only things that spoil what would other wise
be a pristine area.

== 9 of 9 ==
Date: Fri, Mar 7 2008 1:15 pm
From: Anthony Kelly

Kirk,

I'm sorry to hear that only the Tionesta Research Area, and not the Tionesta Scenic Area, was part of the 1987 mineral rights acquisition. I had been under the impression that both areas were covered. It seems to me that most of the oil wells are actually in the Scenic area. I guess they'll be around for a while.
Anthony Kelly

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